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August 31, 2007

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Actually, thats a good question(s). Who arranged and paid for the helicopetr ride? I would also like to ask why it is that Jubal is the only one invited on the ride from the press?

Jubal

1)Where exactly was this press conference held?

The parking lot of a business park near the intersection of Main and MacArthur. I don't know why it was held there.

2)Also, why were you invited to the helicopter ride?

I presume it's because I'm supportive of completing the 241 and we have an influential readership.

3) At what time does the traffic in the particular spot where this conference was filmed begin to pile up?

What am I? Caltrans? I didn't pick the spot.

1)Who arranged for the helicopter tour of the alignment route?

I presume it was the TCA, since they are the one's trying to complete the 241 and it was a TCA staffer who was guiding the tour.

2) Who paid for the helicopter tour of the alignment route?

It stands to reason it was TCA. Or maybe it was the Trilateral Commission or the WTO. I can say the helicopter wasn't black.

Cow

Jubal was invited because he can provide the readers of Red County a live footage of the event.

If the LA Times have a reporter that can go around and video this kind of stuff and upload it in You Tube, i'm sure Tran and other folks will be inviting them on other tours as well.

Jubal

...Jubal HIMSELF was an anon...

Actually, I was pseudonymous. Posting anonymously involves using many names or no name.

Jubal

Actually, thats a good question(s).

And why are complimenting yourself for asking "good questions"?

"Actually, I was pseudonymous. Posting anonymously involves using many names of no name."

For example Trung Diep who uses the moniker(s) Tomohawk, Little Saigon Watch, Milkman, and Cow.

Jubal

A strange accusation from one who comments under various names, real and fictitious.

Jubal some follow up questions to your responses to the above questions;

1) What is the name of the TCA staffer who led the guided helicopter tour?

2) Do you believe it is ethical or even legal to use public funds (TCA Funds) to provide for a slanted press conference on a project that has little merits on its actual stated mission (Traffic Relief) There is not a traffic problem in the area of the proposed alignment route as of yet until the demand is created by developments in the open lands adjacent tot he proposed route alignment.

3) Why would a press conference centered on Traffic Relief at the terminal end of Orange County's leg of the 5 Freeway be held at the corner of Main and MacArthur one of the worst traffic choke points in the county?

4) I know you answered the above question in stating that you had no idea why but I wanted to reiterate it to accentuate my point that the traffic at the El Toro Y will not be affected in the negative or positive by the extension of the 241 Toll Road in its current proposed alignment. My follow up question is this; what traffic is to be relived by the proposed extension alignment? Who will benefit (which subdivisions in existence, under construction or planned will benefit?) from the extension?

5) What is your stance or answer to the Marine Corp Commandant who does not want this extension due to the fact that it passes too close to Marine Barracks tot he point that it poses a threat to our men and women in Uniform from terrorist attack from the toll road itself? An attack can be easily launched against our Marines from the toll road?


)

Jubal

An attack can be easily launched against our Marines from the toll road?

As opposed to being launched from the I-5, San Onofre State Beach, Cristianitos Road or anywhere else nearby?

Good report Jubal!

Jubal,

Thanks for the reporting on this important issue, which has been dragging on for years while we all muddle in congested traffic. It is getting worse everyday.


All of Southern California residents will be impacted by congested traffic. I am glad that Calvert and Tran took the lead on this issue and make it public for all to understand. They are thinking and acting out of the box and not being parochial about "whose district" it is. All residents and businesses up and down the Southern California traffic corridor will be directly affeceted by congested traffic in Orange County, no matter where you are on the road.

Traffic problem affects ALL

Hey Pedroza,

There you go again spewing unsubstantiated allegation against Calvert and Tran. You don't change your spots do you?

As for whether the 241 is in or out of Calvert's or Tran's legislative districts, you should ask this simple question: Don't over 1 million of their combined constituents and thousands of business owners drive through, or are being impacted directly by the 241, or the lack of an extension? No duh!

Jubal,
Those areas are not any where near where our troops actually lay their heads at night. Cristianitos road I-5, San Onofre Beach is also not viable options for an attack seeking to inflict massive damage and body counts on our Marines.

First, I-5. At no point along the I 5 are there points to provide direct line of sight to launch an attack. I-5 is heavily patrolled by the CHP, Border Patrol, Marine Corps, and SCE Security for he SONGS Power Plant, and is too highly visible the and accessible to the public to launch an attack without being discovered and reported by somebody.

Second, San Onofre Park. There are detection devices set up along the stretch of I-5 approaching the park in order to detect attacks on the SONGS Power plant. Second the area is under heavy surveillance to secure the SONGS Plant from attack. Third, the Park does not afford enough points to reach targets of opportunity to make an attack on the marines from that area a viable option in the sense of planning execution and loss of men (terrorists) from counter attack. That area is manned with only a couple of dozen Marines to maybe a hundred during maneuvers to make it a viable target.

Third, Cristianitos road. At any point along Cristianitos Road, the set back from that road to any target of opportunity on the base is at least 2 miles. Any weapons used to launch an attack from that road would have to penetrate several sentry posts and layers of security and travel miles before reaching any barracks, infrastructure or valuable equipment before getting destroyed by the Marines. That’s assuming that they are not detected and destroyed beofre the even get anywhere near the Cristianitos Road offramp.

Finally, the proposed extension alignment presents opportunities for terrorists to launch attacks against Our Marines with weapons as small as a shoulder fired RPG. Hell a bucket and two lengths of surgical tubing can launch a grenade or even a balloon full of gasoline onto our troops.

In addition, I find it somewhat troubling that a commissioner on the Orange County Harbors Beaches and Parks Commission is such a string advocate of building a road through a State Park. This is just my opinion, but I would like to think that a Commissioner on the County’s HBP Commission would be an advocate for preserving open space and parklands and not be an advocate for building a road through them whether they are State or County Parks lands.

Jubal you never answered the questions I asked earlier. I will reprint them for your convenience;

1) What is the name of the TCA staffer who led the guided helicopter tour?

2) Do you believe it is ethical or even legal to use public funds (TCA Funds) to provide for a slanted press conference on a project that has little merits on its actual stated mission (Traffic Relief) There is not a traffic problem in the area of the proposed alignment route as of yet until the demand is created by developments in the open lands adjacent to the proposed route alignment.

3)what traffic is to be relived by the proposed extension alignment? Who will benefit (which subdivisions in existence, under construction or planned will benefit?) from the extension?

Thank you in advance for your in depth response.

Disingenuous?

Let me get this straight. A six lane toll road would NOT provide traffic relief to the 5 and 405?

Wasting 20 years and $20 million in environmental reviews would be fine, but paying for a helicopter tour for two elected officials is a waste?

And this is my favorite - Armed Services Committee Member Ken Calvert doesn’t care about the safety of our Marines as much as the Sierra Club and the Surf-rider Foundation do?

Sanchez is Chairwoman of the Subcommittee on Border, Maritime and Global Counterterrorism and against the 241 extension - and hasn’t said a word about this project threatening the safety of the Marines.

Is anyone else finding these criticisms all a bit disingenuous?

Art Pedroza

Why don't we just widen the 5 freeway?

redperegrine

It's an interesting problem. There's no doubt that the 241 completion would provide local relief on the I-5 between say, the El Toro Y and San Clemente(at least until the RMV is built out); but the southern choke point on I-5 would only move farther south and be a lot worse without a concomittant widening of the 5 - really all the way to San Diego. I think Art's partly right.

Unfortunately there appears to be a sort of knee-jerk reaction from some folks on both sides who value symbolism more than substance. The "build it at any cost" proponents and the "end of the world as we know it" opponents. They seem to feed of each other.

Well, maybe there is no middle ground here, only a TCA burial ground.

re: redperegrine

RP, I see your point on the need to widen the 5 at one point, but that will take years and much eminent domain in order to do so, and we all know how popular that is

i wouldn't call it a "knee jerk reaction" as much as a step in the right direction.

Tom Tucker

Matt, you are 100% correct.

redperegrine

Completing the 241 is not a knee-jerk reaction; but the automatic devotion to paving things seems to be characteristic of some people; just like some of the environmentalists appear to be genetically predisposed to immediately oppose any kind of proposed development at all.

Art Pedroza

The TCA is private you say? Well then I would imagine that their board would reflect that. So let's take a look at who is on the Foothill/Eastern Transportation Corridor Agency Board of Directors:

1. Lance MacLean, Mission Viejo City Council
2. Jerry Amante, Tustin City Council
3. Sam Allevato, San Juan Capistrano City Council
4. Jim Thor, RSM City Council
5. Lisa Bartlett, Dana Point City Council
6. Pat Bates, OC Supervisor
7. Carlos Bustamante, Santa Ana City Council (Why the heck is Carlos on this board?)
8. Bill Campbell, OC Supervisor
9. Jim Dahl, San Clemente City Council
10. Peter Herzog, Lake Forest City Council
11. Jan Horton, Yorba Linda City Council
12. Sukhee Kang, Irvine City Council
13. Lucille Kring, Anaheim City Council
14. Mark Murphy, Orange City Council
15. Chris Norby, OC Supervisor

Oh, sure, that looks like a private organization's board of directors. Not.

Even the TCA website admits that the toll roads are public infrastructure. They are paid for by bonds, and their website admits that the bonds are paid for with toll proceeds. And who pays the tolls? The public.

I rest my case. The copter ride was a waste of money meant to showcase Tran and to a lesser extent Calvert, and the extension of the 241 is all about serving the developers, not the public.

Tran is only involved because he wants to run against Sanchez, and she is opposed to the 241 extension.

BTW, Tran serves on these committees:

Governmental Organization
Judiciary
Utilities and Commerce

None of them have much to do with Transportation, or the 241.

What we need to do is widen the 5.

Re: Art Pedroza

I wonder how it must feel to have your opinion on a project be based on who supports or doesn't support said project.

Art Mentirosa

So speaketh Art Pedroza, the high priest of knowing-nothing.

Art Mentirosa

What we need to do is widen the 5.

Looks like Art found some time to talk to Andrew Davey and get some talking points. Ignorance loves company.

Arty

I think Art is jealous because he doesn't get invited to things as a member of the press, nobody takes him seriously.

Arty

...but the southern choke point on I-5 would only move farther south and be a lot worse without a concomittant widening of the 5 - really all the way to San Diego.

In that case we should not widen the 405 north because that "only moves the chokepoint" into L.A. County.

It's not going to make the chokepoint any worse, because it's still the same motorists going south. the 241 extension just lets them get to the 5 more quickly.

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