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October 24, 2006

Comments

Andrew

The Supes really did fail to do anything meaningful to rectify this nasty situation...
How sad.

I support the decision by the Board. Isn't this America where someone is "innocent until proven guilty." Oh wait, the Democrats, Scott Baugh, and the media have Tan as being guilty until proven innocent. Pull your heads out of your butts, and let the investigators do their job.

demmother

Business as usual in Orange County -

Republicans (albeit, this instance involves a rogue that neither party will own) seem to make a big mess that the taxpayers pay to clean up (I can't wait to see McPherson's taxpayer funded campaign piece - and let's not excuse the technicalities); or in the case of the Voter Registration Fraud, so far, the Dems had to pay for that tab.

Where can I send my bill?

JozefColomy

I've seen nothing but pure, unadulterated, partisan venom come out of Mr. Barbaro's mouth in the time since I could no longer find a way to avoid listening to what he says.

Look, this whole issue wouldn't be such a big deal if Democrats, nationwide, weren't running such obstructionist, negative campaigns. I mean, yes the mailer was distasteful, but it was by no means illegal. Suppressing the right to vote? Hardly. I don't remember anyone holding people hostage and keeping them from voting in addition to the letter being mailed. I can't remember when someone was physically stopped from voting. The same goes for Mr. Barbaro's "examples". Like the "uniformed guards". There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. He calls it intimidation, but if people are going to leave a place simply because they see some sign of authority, then they probably have something to hide. Not to mention the fact, that he conveniently forgot to disclose to everyone, that no one was ever physically stopped from voting in 1988. Also Mr. Barbaro acts as though people complaining of voter registration fraud automatically makes it true. You'd think that a liberal, of all people, would follow the innocent until proven guilty statute. Apparently not for Republicans, though.

Jubal

Could Frank Barbaro possibly be more full of hot air? It's hard to imagine.

Give it up, Frank. This attempt to conflate the actions as a single individual -- whom you are fortunate left your party a less than two years ago -- is cynical, pathetic and mendacious.

A letter is being sent from the Sec. of State -- a fact the OC Dems insist on ignoring.

If Frank wants a GOTV letter sent to those 14,000 Latino Demnocrats, I suggest he raised the money to pay for one instead of sticking the taxpayers with the bill. But then again, he's a Democrat and being true to his nature.

Jubal

And Denmother, tell me again who "made the mess"? Was it the generic "Republicans" or a specific campaign?

And please explain to me the justification of TWO taxpayer-funded letters as clarification for a SINGLE mail piece?

Even Lou Correa ended up backing away from this hare-brained idea.

redperegrine

And yet the ever-helpful Lynn Daucher made an offer to pay for a mailer. Why didn't the Supes take her upon it? Interesting bluff n'est-ce-pas?

Oh Jozef-
You're one of the guys who gives Republicans a bad name by defending this action. I'll give you that Tan has not been convicted or charged of any crime yet, but it's becoming more clear every day that all signs point to him AND his campaign.
You really should try to do some research on this stuff before you spout off with what you HOPE to be true. It's not merely "distasteful."
1. Any form of voter intimidation in California is clearly against the law. This includes the stationing of uniformed poll guards.
2. Attempts to suppress voting by those eligible and duly registered would also be considered by most (before this week I would have said everyone, but I've been disproven) to be IMMORAL.
3. I would consider attempts to suppress voting among a particular ethnic group not only illegal and immoral, but also RACIST.
4. Finally, unless you have spoken personally with everyone who attempted to vote in the 1988 election at polling places with the uniformed guards, you have no way of actually knowing if those scare tactics worked.
I would also like to know which Democrats you allude to are running these "obstructionist, negative campaigns."

Frank:

DON'T GIVE IT UP.

In the past weeks, the Democratic Party in Orange County has done more than we've seen for many years.

The Republicans are getting restless. You're starting to fight fire with fire.

KEEP FIGHTING BACK.

JozefColomy

Holy Didn't-Read-My-Comment Batman!

Mr./Ms. Anon at 9:43,

First, and foremost, I never said I defended Mr. Nguyen's actions. At all. Ever. In fact, in other articles, I've chastised him for performing an unnecessary disservice to us as Republicans. Secondly, informing people that something that is illegal is illegal is no crime. Otherwise we would criminalize speed limit signs on freeways, or no-smoking signs, etc. You see, I try to maintain a voice of sensibility amongst the far right and left. The far left is calling this a crime, which it is not. The far right is applauding Tan, which they should not. I find myself somewhere down the middle, although I feel that the left calling it a "crime" is a more severe misrepresentation than condoning such behavior. Thirdly, whether I remember something firsthand doesn't change the fact that the OC Democrats cannot rewrite history. I would absolutely love for you to dig up a case where a voter was physically kept from voting. I'll save you some time with that--you won't find it. Fourthly, it's not even so much the actual campaigns the Democrats are running as much as it is the Democrats themselves. I'm not talking about OC Dem candidates; they are a pretty civil bunch. I'm talking about Dems on a national level, who appear to just support the opposite of whatever the Republicans do, regardless of whether or not they had a plan to begin with. Case in point: Nancy Pelosi, House Minority Leader, has gone on record responding to the question "What is your plan for America?" with the reply of "Why should we put a plan out? Our plan is to stop [President Bush]. He must be stopped." Or Harry Reid, Senate Minority Leader, who was invited, along with any other member of Congress, by the President to share any ideas regarding Social Security, said "Instead of talking about ways to save Social Security, Republicans are talking about a plan that will destroy it." That's fine, he's entitled to his opinion, but until he has his own idea, he should not be taking an obstructionist path. This is the rhetoric coming out of the mouths of the leaders of the DNC, and that is disturbing. These people do not have any plan for America, only a plan to obstruct Republicans and gain power. And these are the people with whom Frank Barbaro is allying himself and all Orange County Democrats and for that I feel bad.

thanks for nuthin'

I remember a day when the lights went out. Why? Because California's energy was sold to the highest bidder. Thanks Enron.

And, John Campbell, no thanks for doing nothing to insure it will never happen to California again!

So, go ahead bicker some more on some useless information, supposed to fire my imagination...

Huh?

Elroy El

Jose,

You said:

"Case in point: Nancy Pelosi, House Minority Leader, has gone on record responding to the question "What is your plan for America?" with the reply of "Why should we put a plan out? Our plan is to stop [President Bush]. He must be stopped."

What more do you need? That in in itself would be an improvement over the status quo. Having the opposition party control the legislature will create gridlock. Which right now would be a good thing.

Elroy El

Jose,

It never ceases to amaze me, that if a Republican does the same thing that Republicans have been angry at Democrats for doing, suddenly it’s okay. You know like out of control spending. The next thing Republicans will be defending Bush for is Cutting and Running. Oh excuse me, “Managed Withdrawal.”


Those of us old enough to remember the Nixon era remember another term as it relates to disastrous foreign policies. It was called Vietnamization.

Jozef: you say that only the "far left" is calling this a crime.

How, then, do you explain folks like Gov. Schwarzenegger, Lynn Daucher, and Carlos Bustamante calling it the same?

You're entitled to your own set of opinions, but not your own set of facts.

Quang

Elroy El, ease up on young Josef...

You remember and "read" about Vietnamization; some of us lived through it first hand.

http://www.military.com/opinion/0,15202,91564,00.html

rebecca

Oh, those nasty Dems, huh Jozef? Did you know that 98 percent of the ads the NRCC is running are negative and based on personal attacks:

From Talkingpointsmemo.com:

"Huge amount of independent expenditures today by the NRCC: $9.3 million.
Here are the biggest hits:
$424,948.80 against Democratic challenger Darcy Burner in the WA-8;
$571,073.60 against Democratic challenger Patrick Murphy in PA-8;
$657,276.80 against Democratic challenger Joe Sestak in PA-7;
$652,884.80 against Democratic challenger Lois Murphy in PA-6;
$579,187.60 against Democrat Zack Space in the race for Bob Ney's open OH-18 seat;
$521,985.88 against Democratic incumbent Rep. Melissa Bean in IL-8;
$436,881.00 against Democratic challenger Ron Klein in FL-22;
$417,933.39 against Democratic challenger Ken Lucas in KY-4;
A whopping 99% of today's expenditure was for negative advertising."

Oh, sorry, it's 99 percent, not 98. My mistake.
Who is it who doesn't have a record to run on, again???

R. Chris

Josef
Ok, let's just say for a moment that its okay to send a letter to non-citizens telling them its illegal for them to vote. But how about the blatent lies in the letter referring to a tracking system? If that isn't intimidation, I really don't know what is? That IS a veiled threat.

Let's not play dumb here - the letter was mailed to immigrants with Spanish surnames - you cannot possibly tell me there was no ill intent here. Maybe if Tan sent the letter to EVERYONE you could make a semi-plausible argument.

If you're going to try and find the balance between the left and the right then please remember that Democrats aren't the only one running nasty, negative campaigns.

Republicans claiming that if the Dems control congress we will be attacked in the US - that isn't a nasty scare tatic?

Limbaugh sinking so low as to accuse Michael Fox of faking his Parkinson's for political gain?

The White House provides talk show hosts like Limbaugh and OReilly with talking points on a daily basis so you can't say the venom pouring from them doesn't come from the National Republican Party.

Please tell me how Stay the Course in Iraq is a plan?

Please tell me the Republicans (the so-called fiscal conservatives) have a plan to reduce the deficit.

Please tell me the plan to control skyrocketing health care costs.

We all have our biases but please don't claim to be the balanced voice of moderation when you fail to see the manure in your own yard.

Elroy El

R. Chris, and Rebecca. You don't actually expect the Repubs to run on their records? Do you?

When the record is as poor as what we're seeing, going negative and fear mongering is all that is left.

demmother

Jubal,

I will be happy to answer your inquiry.

1. Neal Kelly, OC Registrar is a taxpayer funded civil servant who is not supposed to have an agenda. The CA Secretary of State is an elected (in this case appointed) partisan office. I agree that two letters would be redundant, my preference would have been the county registrar; especially since the CA Sec of State is up for election this year. The official letterhead still bears the candidates name. Is it a perk for holding the office? - you bet. I think if Shelley were still in office you would be singing a different tune.

2. Republican messes - It looks like the taxpayers are covering the current tempest. I do not hold the OCGOP responsible for this incident. I will say that I and many others naturally assumed in the beginning that it was a Republican stunt. Unfortunately the OCGOP has been found to be behind other events in the past. 1988 and 1996 are two examples.

What you prefer not to discuss, and dismiss when brought up are the 500 plus complaints by voters who were switched to Republican without thair knowledge or consent in the Primary by GOP hired consultants who were more interested in making the money than keeping the integrity of the right to vote for the party/individual of choice. After the wrist slap and the promise by Baugh and others to stop paying consultants, the practice continued through the summer and fall. The individuals who did/are doing this should be arrested and tried to the full extent of the law. The too little too late response of Kelly meant the DPOC had to pay for the data and spend the time to notify potential victims. Kelly also promised that anyone who went to vote who protested their registration would be allowed to vote provisionaly for the party they identified with. I know of one case where that did not happen and were it not for a friend helping at that particular site, that voter would have been disenfranchised.

If you guys don't create another taxpayer funded special election in 2007, we may be able to straighten the Registration mess out.

Elroy El

After rereading Chris's post. Did Limbaugh really accuse Michael J. Fox of faking Parkinson's? The question then needs to be asked if Limbaugh is abusing drugs again?

No one could be that stupid. What is scarier is there are ditto head followers who probably believe Fox illness is a fraud.

6:58am wrote
"Jozef: you say that only the 'far left'is calling this a crime.

How, then, do you explain folks like Gov. Schwarzenegger, Lynn Daucher, and Carlos Bustamante calling it the same?

You're entitled to your own set of opinions, but not your own set of facts".

HELLO, somebody needs to knock you in the head with a hammer. Don't you understand that these political figures only condemn Tan to go with the majority in order to get votes for themselves? They could care less about who is right or wrong, they only worry about gaining more votes by supporting the majority's opinion. Everybody has a purpose.

Jubal

Denmother:

Neal Kelly, OC Registrar is a taxpayer funded civil servant who is not supposed to have an agenda. The CA Secretary of State is an elected (in this case appointed) partisan office. That's irrelevant to the purpose of the letter. The Dems calls for corrective letter to be sent didn't specify it be from a civil servant, not an elected official." The OC Dems are trying to squeeze as much political mileage out of this as possible. That's their job. Two GOTV letters to 14,000 central OC Latino Dems are better than one letter -- especially when the taxpayers are picking up the tab.

The official letterhead still bears the candidates name. Is it a perk for holding the office? - you bet. I think if Shelley were still in office you would be singing a different tune.

That's a classic misdirection tactic of partisans of either party: "I bet you'd feel differently if we were talking about a Democrat/Republican."

My attitude would be precisely the same. Perhaps you've forgotten, but last week I voiced my support for a corrective letter from the ROV before the SOS decided to send one. But the SOS moved quickly, obviating any need for the county to undertake a duplicative letter.

I will say that I and many others naturally assumed in the beginning that it was a Republican stunt. Unfortunately the OCGOP has been found to be behind other events in the past. 1988 and 1996 are two examples.

This was a stunt by a Republican, not a Republican stunt. The poll gurads incident was an OC GOP action to hire polling station watchers gone awry. The staffer assigned to hire the poll watchers went and hired uniformed security guards (which he was not instructed to do) and the controversy was born.

The 1996 instance you cite was Barbara Coe's group, not the OC GOP.

Any other examples?

As for the registration-switchers, justice will be dealt to them, but trying to label it an OC GOP scandal is just wrong. The OC GOP is interested is good registrations, not fraudulent ones. The registration flipping not only cheated those voters, it cheated the OC GOP, as well. To contend this was done deliberately defies reason.

And Scott Baugh never said the party wouldn't use a paid registration program. He said the party would use Bader & Associates any longer as the vendor -- and Bader is getting out of that business anyway.

The fact remains that paid registration program did more to close the central OC registration gap between Reps and Dems than the previous 10+ years of volunteer-based efforts. The OC Dem Party got caught asleep at the switch and allowed the Reps to steal a march on them. The OC Dems want the paid registration program ended because its a threat to them in central OC. They've been screaming about the program in the hope the OC GOP will go wobbly and suspend it. Fortunately, Scott Baugh has smarts and spine, so the OC Dems prolonged tantrum won't work.

If you guys don't create another taxpayer funded special election in 2007...
??? What are you talking about?

Elroy El

If you guys don't create another taxpayer funded special election in 2007...
??? What are you talking about?

I won't pretend to put words in denmother's mouth, but it was obvious from the beginning the Special Election was unnecessary. This complete waste of time and energy was funded by the taxpayer. Two good things came out of it. The Governor realized his advisors were leading him down a path that would have ruined him and he fired them. Secondly he has moved to a more moderate stance that enables him to actually get something done and represents more of the people he represents. I have to give him credit for hiring someone as intelligent as Susan Kennedy. Had she been his CoS I doubt she would have taken down that path.

rebecca

Don't forget teh recall the year before that! You Republicans sure do love to spend our taxpayer money.

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