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May 12, 2006

Comments

Word is that Hunt will get 200K in IE. What a waste of money!

OC's Finest

Poster at 6:54,

Hate to bust your Carona bubble, dude, but Lt. Hunt will be getting a lot more than that! Just watch. Law enforcement is 10-8 for Lt. Hunt!!!

Kibbuttzer

I don't like being called a Monday Morning QB anymore than the rest of us, but I gotta ask Jubal & friends this: Who did AOCDS use to do this mailer?

A message must be in there somewhere, but what a waste of paper & postage!!!

From a printing/marketing perspective, frankly the copy is WEAK and the graphics leave mucho to be desired. I don't like to bag on anyone getting PAID to do campaign work, but did some Deputy brushing up for life after OCSO do this gratis???

Too much info and too convoluted. Defies all logic taught in Campaign schools to communicate one message point with reinforcemet of collateral POSITIVES of the candidate.

But then again, maybe this is the best the Consultant could do based on the WEAK overall substance of the Hunt Campaign???

The only good thing is that the use of "badges" and cop pics will cause more readers to take a few more seconds (x2) to look before they toss this out in the garbage.

It will tossed in the garbage like every other mailer. So what, you didn't like it...I'm guessing "they" didn't call you for your advice for a reason. Thanks for your opinion, have a nice day.

Carona Must Go

Art Pedroza posted this last night on "Orange Juice." I have to agree with Art, Baugh has lost control of the OC GOP, maybe he too is being controlled by Fleishman and Schroeder. Watch out who you keep around as friends, look what is happening to Carona right now...His bank is going to the dogs because of those two.

"Just when I thought there might be some hope for Scott Baugh, the OC GOP Chairman, I found out tonight that he refused to allow OC GOP Central Committee member Tim Whitacre to participate in a scheduled OC GOP Executive Committee meeting that was held at Baugh's office earlier today. Whitacre was appointed to the OC GOP Executive Committee by the 69th Assembly District GOP Caucus. That means that Baugh was totally out of order by refusing to let Whitacre participate in the meeting.

Baugh even called the police and tried to have Whitacre arrested. That ploy failed and Whitacre ended up getting a police report from the police officers attesting to the fact that Baugh illegally tried to keep an elected member of the OC GOP Executive Committee out of a meeting that he had every right to participate in.

Mark Bucher was the only Executive Committee member who even tried to talk Baugh out of this ridiculous and illegal course of action. The rest of them went along sheepishly with Baugh. Needless to say, Whitacre will probably sue Baugh for this too, in addition to his other lawsuit over the Carona endorsement fiasco.

In all the years that I have been involved with the OC GOP Central Committee, I have never seen such a mess. I have had enough. Baugh needs to step down immediately. He simply cannot function as Chair of the OC GOP. I hope that Bucher will replace him. Certainly no one else on the Executive Committee has the huevos to say no to the Schroeders and Fleischmans of the world. Somebody has to rise above the fray and run the party ethically. It is readily apparent that Baugh is not that person."

So Baugh stood up to the Bully and now the bully is crying?

The police did not take a report attesting to the fact that Baugh acted "illegally". They only documented a dispute between the two parties. A "Crime Report" was not taken.

I often read posts from Hunt/Whitacre supporters who contradict themselves. At times they refer to Fleischman and Schroeder as bumbling buffoons. Then at other times they refer to them as master conspirators pulling the strings of the OC Republican Party, Chiefs of Police, Local Media, local Politicians and anyone else who happens to disagree with them.

They often refer to them as "sheep" or say they act "sheepishly"

Keep up the good work Scott and don't give the bully an inch!

Listen to ourselves. Yes, Mike & Jon are pulling strings. Although they really do come across like buffoons.

Schroeder is proud of the mess because he created it. With Carona and Tony owing him and Jon as his sidekick Schroeder feels pretty good.

The party is beginning to suffer as has the Sheriff's department. The county is also beginning to feel it.

Carona and Schroeder even has the DA investigating Sheriff dept members with a witch hunt that will blow up their face soon. They are going after respected people who will fight back with backing that will eventually be the downfall of the accusers.

Carona Must Go

Trust me, I don't believe Whitacre is crying, quite the contrary, they woke a sleeping giant. The OC GOP will suffer due to the actions, reactions and behind the scenes power plays of Schroeder and Fleishman.

And Carona, who has proven that he is neither a cop nor politician, will continue to suffer. Carona continues to put everything into what these two say and he is making selfish decisions based on what is good for him and not what is good for the county, the citizens and the members of the Orange County Sheriff's Dept.

Carona will fail, and it is due, in part, to his relationship with Schroeder and Fleishman.

Oooohhhh Nooooo! Its the Flieschman/Schroeder bogeyman! Run for your lives!

Why is it when Whitacre plays fast and loose with the facts to manipulate his fellow GOP members he's just passionate? yet when his opponents fight with that same "passion" they're pulling strings and underhanded?

The Huntistas are a whiny bunch! They remind me of a spoiled child who has a tantrum every time things fail to go their way!

No wonder people like Jim Lacey pulled their endorsement from Hunt!

Is that all you got, the Lacy thing again. My God, where have you been? That was months ago. Either keep up with the times or I will tell your mother not to let you play on the computer again. Now go to your room and quit touching yourself.

You Huntistas are a riot. You call Lacy ancient history after only a few months yet you harp about Carona's history in 1998.

Double standards seem to be your specialty.

KIP

I am thoroughly convinced that the corollary agenda of “Carona Chronicles” is to destroy Station 18 if Hunt is not elected. Deputies posting there are creating a no quarter environment in which simpatico will be impossible. Either these deputies are vindictive, smitten by blind loyalty, or stupid. In either case, it is obvious that they neglected even modicum of analysis. If they had, they would have realized that Hunt has a snowball’s chance in hell of prevailing in the primary election. Moreover, they are wont to make assumptions that do not follow from facts. The result is that they are willing to destroy Station 18 in order to get what they want. And they are willing to inflict misery in working relationships if they don’t get it. Either way, THEY HAVE PLACED THEIR SELFISH MOTIVES ABOVE ALL ELSE!!!

I am not a supporter of Carona, and fortunately I have never had to work for him. But I will give him credit in that he knew he wanted to be sheriff and he paved a road to his goal. I will concede that Brad Gates, with his outright obduracy and thick head greatly aided Carona, but the fact remains that he ingratiated himself with the right people who allowed him to get to his destination. In essence, he stole Gates’ base of support (read: The Lincoln Club). And herein lies the soul of Hunt’s troubles: the sheriff is a politician and not necessarily a cop. Gates used to frequently cite the fact that he was a much better politician than cop. In my opinion, he was weak in both categories but excellent at intimidation! And it was his excellence in the latter category that thwarted his promoting his legacy! If Gates had been smart, he would have allowed his deputies to tell him that people feared his administration and not supported it, that no one believed any were competent. Hunt has to realize he is not running to become the top cop leading the sheriff’s office but a politician. His campaign must keep in mind that he is seeking political office. So what does this mean?

Idealism will not win elections, especially at the local level. There is huge world outside of the sheriff’s office, and many residing therein do not share Hunt’s supporters’ passion for political change. I have a friend who did run for political office in a very large Southern California county. Just yesterday, he told me before any pleasantries, “Carona is going to win, easily!” What is especially poignant is that he thinks Carona is dirty, and coming from a career prosecutor, that is hugely significant! This friend has direct knowledge of running in countywide elections, and he told me that support of fellow deputies is meaningless. What matters is convincing more than fifty percent of voters that a change of politicians is to their advantage. And to effectuate this, that is: to defeat an incumbent is nearly impossible. The incumbent has three distinct advantages; name recognition, money, and most importantly: incumbency! The difference between his campaign and the rogue deputies at Station 18 is that he was not willing to destroy his agency in order to win. He recognized that reckless indifference to the process could destroy the sanctity of the office for which he campaigned.

It is utterly appalling that a few antagonistic deputies are willing to create hostility within their workplace. Their fellow Hunt supporters or Hunt himself should tug the reigns on them before the damage they are causing is irreversible. And what is truly amazing is that they’re eager to destroy Station 18 will little to no chance of achieving success. Moreover, they are quick to recite platitudes about effecting change and nobility, but their myopia prevents their recognizing that other deputies have equally valid positions that are antithetical to theirs. The new one over at CC is that law enforcement is not a profession, so I guess that means it is okay to stoop to mafia techniques to get what they want. Amazing!!! Compounding their destructive behavior is the no quarter attitude of their campaign: it is either Hunt or destruction. What pisses me off to no end is that these classless idiots do not have the courtesy to quit: they would rather make everybody as miserable as they are if they do not get what THEY want! And the fact is, on June 7th they’ll resume working for the man they despise. Moreover, they have refused or neglected to recognize this most obvious fact; if Hunt does not prevail on June 6th, they’ll have but two choices: quit or continuing to work to one they have opined to be immoral and unethical. Hence, if they chose the latter, they’ll expose their stance upon nobility as mere illusion, smoke-and-mirrors.

Why is analysis and prediction so difficult???

Disgusted Central Committee Member

Poster at 10:21,

Tim Whitacre did not play "fast and lose with the facts", as you claim. In fact, he brought with him a mountain of evidence to the contrary at the last central committee meeting, that totally blew away the trumped up claims against him.

However, guess what? Baugh's a**-kissing parlimentarian, Kermit Marsh, also a fellow lawyer, would not allow Tim Whitacre any time to present any rebuttal, before the circus began. Therefore, instead of using the limited time given to defend himself, Tim chose to defend the integrity and reputation of our Central Committee. He spoke about the rule of law and how our by-laws were being totally ignored. He appealed to everyone present to put aside bias and act in accordance with established by-laws, otherwise we would greatly embarrass the Republican Party of O.C. by blindly following the scheme put forth by Schroeder and Fleischman, and approved by Baugh and Marsh and others, in order to guarantee an endorsement for Carona on the second try.

I honestly wish I had more courage and drive to stand up and fight the men Tim is fighting, but I have been on Central Committee too long and am just simply disgusted with what I see continuing to happen from a small group of men, mostly lawyers, who are content to make up the rules as they go along in order to make sure whatever they want to do, happens.

I have chosen to not run for Republican Party Central Committee again. Others who have either recently resigned or who are not running again for the same reasons, are simply fed up with the corruption. I want no part of the un-Republican behavior I see coming from those in leadership.

Who knows, maybe Tim will spark something that causes us all to wake up and fix the massive internal problems that come from men without regard to playing by the rules. I can only wish Tim the best of luck and am praying for right to prevail here. Because of my position, sadly, I cannot protest openly and I guess that makes me a hypocrite. However, to everyone else reading this, I want to close with a quote that Tim sent out to all his fellow Central Committee Members with a plea to stand up. admit error, fix the problem and be a better Party for it.

"TO SIN BY SILENCE WHEN THEY SHOULD PROTEST, MAKES COWARDS OF MEN."
Abraham Lincoln

Things that make you go Hmmm

There appears to be alot of dissension, anger and division within the ranks of the OC GOP. These same issues currently plague the OC Sheriff's Department and at one time caused problems inside the OC District Attorney's office.

To find a solution one must first identify the problem. What is the common denominator in all of the above? Mike Schroeder. Mike Schroeder. Mike Schroeder. Hmmm, interesting.

What do you get when you change around the 1st five letters of "DENOMinator." DEMON

Hmmm, interesting.

Hunt 4 Sheriff

Vindictive? Stupid? Blind Loyalty? You offer only conclusionary extremism. You state that you're not a Carona supporter, but you certainly are a Hunt Super-detractor. Pure and simple: Carona has failed. Carona failed in all of his pledges made in 1998 that includes the entirety of his Ten-Point plan that he swore would make the OCSD better: Reduce Jail Overcrowding -NO; Not Expand Musick jail -NO: Term Limits -NO; Reduce Operational Cost -NO; Submit to External Audit -NO; Resolve CCW Issue -NO; Separate Coroner's Office -NO; Redistribute Prop 172 Funds -NO; Build Public/Private Partnerships (privatize jails) -NO; Increase Accountability –ABSOLOUTELY NOT!

Yes, Gates failed us miserably when he failed to plan for a transition. Doug Storm, Tim Simon and others also failed us by acting like they were leaders but shrinking away from the challenge when it mattered most. In his last days, Gates challenged his lieutenants to take the lead –none did (too bad Hunt was only an Investigator then); that was a direct result of failure in leadership by Gates.

Currently, there is a great amount of strongly suspected collusion between the union boss –Wayne Quint and Carona to thwart Hunt. And Sgt. Rich White, who happens to be a long time/senior union PAC member, is a staunch Carona supporter. White initiated this blog war by starting The Tin Star –a blatantly pro-Carona anti-Hunt site. Not until many union members complained did White “tone down” his anti-Hunt rhetoric. In the Tin Star there are numerous ugly, vindictive, stupid and blindly loyal postings made by White’s Carona followers. The anti-Hunt people reference Hunt supporters as Huntinistas –a clear inference to the radical left-wing Sandinistas –clearly inflammatory, wouldn’t you agree? Hunt is a solid Republican. Hunt is a true conservative and none of his supporters stooped to this level, yet when dealing with a constant barrage of BS from White’s followers they can hardly be restrained. It has been in response to what White started and has allowed that the now famous (maybe infamous) CC takes the lead down and dirty, tit-for-tat blogging that we have been seeing. Yet it is the CC that exposes it all regarding Carona and the current affairs of the OCSD without censorship: it’s kind of like an HBO series -if it offends you don’t watch or read it. Both sides post on the CC and nothing is deleted, so when you do your appraisal don’t just pick one side –consider the whole and therein you will find the source of this feud.

As for destroying Station 18: Ask Carona why he won’t keep his promise to only serve two terms. As for intimidation: It is Carona’s team that is threatening the careers of hundreds of deputies and because of the close relationship between Carona, Schroeder and Fleishman and the union leadership, many deputies feel leery about going to their union with a complaint. Ask Carona why he needs to remain when the multitude of his scandals include: cavorting with mafia associates, fooling around with Russian Hotties, selling badges for campaign dollars, abuse of county resources by flying around with his mistress and the several sexual harassment law suits pending are collectively wrecking this once fine Department. Hunt is not the problem –Carona, Schroeder and Fleishman are. Carona should do the right thing and resign. The other two will then become inconsequential and slink away.

And yes, if Carona wins you will see many good deputies retire early and younger ones lateral to other agencies to escape from the corruption and scandal that is currently the OCSD. This will only add to the already large vacancy factor (15%) that the OCSD now suffers under Carona. Those who stay have little alternative.

Carona should stop thinking only of his self and do the right thing for the Department –Resign!

KIP

Hunt 4 Sheriff,

You do not understand: SHERIFF IS A POLITICAL OFFICE. It matter not what you think, it does not matter what I think: it matters what voters do. Allegations against Carona are immaterial if voters elect him!

What I would do is try to figure out the process of winning local elections and predict the outcome of this one. It will save you a whole lot of needless stress!

In 2002, voters relected Carona. It is Carona's agency until someone else is elected. Deputies have to face this fact as I had to under Gates. You either go along with the sheriff or leave. THERE IS NO OTHER ALTERNATIVE!!!

KIP

To the wacko poster who said: "Currently, there is a great amount of strongly suspected collusion between the union boss –Wayne Quint and Carona to thwart Hunt...."

These Huntistas should be chasing UFO's in Area 51.

Here's a bit of info for all of you Hunt conspiracy theorists. It's not a conspiracy! Collectively we dislike your tactics and as individuals we each happen to do our little part to stick up to you. We don't need to plot.

You are easy to despise. Deal with it.

It is unfortunate that your hatred towards Hunt and his supporters is what might get Carona elected for another four years.

Carona is in a tail spin getting ready to crash and burn and he is taking alot of professional deputies with him. I have yet to hear from anyone inside the department tell me why Carona is so great. All I ever hear is Hunt is a bully.

Well I'm sorry you were yelled at by Hunt while in the academy or while you worked under him in either patrol or the jails. Get over it. Carona is a complete failure, personally and professionally, it has been documented, time and time again.

Carona cannot undue the damage he has caused. The hard working men and women of OCSD will have to live with his embarrassing actions and decisions for a long time to come.

Hunt will restore integrity to OCSD and get rid of the likes of Schroeder and Fleishman.

"You either go along with the sheriff or leave. THERE IS NO OTHER ALTERNATIVE!!!

KIP"

Really KIP, (poster 01:40 pm)? That is the mantra of the scared and complacent. It is an excuse to do nothing. We all know what happens when good people do nothing.

You are right about going along with the Sheriff or leave. Well, leave of be moved.

Capt. Blackburn, South Operations Division, did not "go along" and did not choose to leave. He was moved and Capt. Anderson replaced him.

Lt. Bardzik, Reserve Division, did not "go along" and did not choose to leave. He was moved and Newmeister remained who takes orders from Reserve Capt. Dennis, car salesman, Assael.

Assistant Sheriff Gannon, Operation, could not "go along" any more and did choose to leave. Now Assistant Sheriff Galisky runs that show!

Sheriff Dept. insiders will tell you of the rampant promotions of incompetency. Carona advises all his deputies to work off duty hours away from home to obtain higher education. He demands it to be considered for promotion and factors it into the promotion process. Yet, once again, when it suits his agenda, expectations do not apply at the command level.

We have an Assistant Sheriff with no college degree, only a GED!

We have a recently promoted captain in Court Operations, also without any college degree!

People with no higher than a high school diploma being placed into positions of authority because they will do whatever Carona demands, regardless of principle.

Sorry KIP, THERE IS AN ALTERNATIVE......Bill Hunt..

KIP

6:22 PM Poster:


If you think Hunt is a viable alternative to Carona, knock yourself out! However, very few people knowledgeable about local elections share your view. Remember: the worst lie one tells in the one told to one's self! From all indications, Carona will garner 50%> of the vote in the primary.

Your:

"Sheriff Dept. insiders will tell you of the rampant promotions of incompetence."

indicates you are a recent hire. Gates was infamous for promoting incompetents. Try asking one of his promotions to explain the three legal methods of entry into a home and what's required for each. There was a damn good reason why LaDucer told me and other deputies that Station 18 patrol was no better than mediocre vis-à-vis other county agencies. What he failed to acknowledge was that Gates made it that way!!! And let's not forget Ramos' refrain that Station 18 deputies are peace officers and not police officers. But the truth is Station 18 patrol was ridiculed by other agencies!!!

What you must understand is that Station 18 is under the control of Carona, thank you Brad Gates! He WILL run it as he sees fit. Your role in the scheme of things is to accept it or make other choices.

Running for sheriff requires a whole hell of a lot of planning. One does not will one's self sheriff. Carona did it the right way. He prepared himself years ahead for his run. He co-opted the Lincoln Club from under Gates' nose. In short, he had his ducks in a row before he declared his candidacy. Idealism and will just won't cut it. In short, one must know one is going to win before declaring candidacy. It is foolish to declare candidacy and then figure out how to win!

You will harm yourself should you forget that the office of sheriff is political.


KIP

KIP, you are truly scaring me. 80% of your posts have to do with what Brad Gates did to OCSD. I believe you have some sort of love hate relationship with Gates. You seriously need to be medicated.

I'm going to say this slowly so please follow along.

Brad Gates retired from OCSD eight years ago. Repeat it with me if you think it will help.

Brad Gates is RETIRED!!!!!

The parallels between Hunt and Gates are scary! They are both intimidators, surrounded by like minded men. They derive their power by demanding absolute loyalty or they will destroy you by any and all means.

Gates may have retired 8 years ago, but his legacy aka Bill Hunt lives on.

It's a good thing the world has moved on!

I have read numerous times on several blogs that Bill Hunt "Intimidates" people around him. OCSD is not filled with a bunch push overs so what are these people talking about. I have known Bill Hunt for over 20 years and I have never, ever, felt intimidated by him. I have worked the jails and patrol with him; seen him lead the SWAT personnel during dangerous situations and have seen him be a leader on this dept. when others are running and hiding. If you are truly intimidated by Hunt then the problem is yours and yours alone. If you are intimidated by anyone on the Sheriff's dept. then turn your badge and gun in as you are not worthy to wear the badge.

You read my mind poster 9:21. I too have had the pleasure of working with Bill. His contagious optimism and high standards kept us always striving to improve.

KIP,

You really are the master of the obvious. Tell us something we don't know about traditional campaign strategy. Or share some history we did not live through. But please don't serve your low self esteem by telling us what a Chief told you years ago.

What you need to understand is that Carona is going at it one way and Hunt is going at it another way. Both strategies are driven by their money or lack of it so save us the diatribe Sport.

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